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Post by homeschooldad on Jun 1, 2023 15:14:23 GMT
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Post by theguvnor on Jun 1, 2023 16:12:05 GMT
I'm wondering if the flag was there from the WW2 era as it would have been the US flag in use when Paris was liberated.
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Post by tisbearself on Jun 1, 2023 18:53:24 GMT
I cannot imagine any trad American having any issue with Alaska or Hawaii. They don't have controversial bishops or anything. It was probably just a historic flag, maybe a souvenir from WWII or in someone's family, like put on granddad's coffin.
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Post by homeschooldad on Jun 1, 2023 20:10:44 GMT
I cannot imagine any trad American having any issue with Alaska or Hawaii. They don't have controversial bishops or anything. It was probably just a historic flag, maybe a souvenir from WWII or in someone's family, like put on granddad's coffin. Probably something like that. I can't imagine a 48-star flag being any kind of "dog whistle", though the original 13-star flag is sometimes used that way. An archconservative could have an issue with Hawaii being a state, due to its multiculturalism and liberal politics (not condoning the former mindset, and simply stating the latter --- quite frankly, both of those things are what keeps Puerto Rico out, not condoning that either), but with Alaska, there's no "down side", not with all that oil and being a huge piece of real estate next to Russia (just ask Sarah Palin ). Just imagine if they still owned it. Any issues of multiculturalism that anyone might have with the Yup'ik would be confined to Alaska itself (and, likewise, not condoning, just stating the fact), and Alaska skews conservative. Sometimes a flag is just a flag.
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Post by theguvnor on Jun 1, 2023 20:27:20 GMT
I cannot imagine any trad American having any issue with Alaska or Hawaii. They don't have controversial bishops or anything. It was probably just a historic flag, maybe a souvenir from WWII or in someone's family, like put on granddad's coffin. Christ Church Cathedral which is the Church Of Ireland's seat in Ireland put away all the colours of British regiments post-independence. For many years these hung in the rafters getting somewhat tatty. In recent years they've taken them down for memorial services at World War One and Two oriented events. This still causes arguments mind you.
The World War One memorial in my father's home county in Ireland gets vandalized regularly with people smashing statues up or scratching engraved text off. Sadly. I think this is very childish myself. But it is how it is. I've been called, 'A West Brit b*st*d' myself for praying for soldiers from Ireland who died serving in the British military in World War One.
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Post by tisbearself on Jun 1, 2023 21:30:43 GMT
We usually don't have those issues in the US anymore. The Vietnam veterans were treated so badly upon their return that it is now socially unacceptable to criticize any veteran. Many of the veterans were poor or minorities and thus either unable to avoid the draft or without other good career/ educational options, which would make it doubly bad to say anything negative.
The only memorials that raise controversy are the Confederate ones perceived to be racist.
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Post by theguvnor on Jun 1, 2023 22:06:26 GMT
Those who served in British Forces are often characterized retrospectively as 'traitors.' This is particularly thick and shows a very, very poor understanding of Irish history but it is common. I contributed to the memorial for soldiers who served in World War One in my father's country as my great-uncle Dennis was an NCO who was severely wounded at the Somme and invalided out of the service. Like many Irishmen of his era he support Home Rule achieved via political means. His younger brother James who is my paternal grandfather was more radical. But they were still brothers and are buried next to each other. Such family divides politically were common. Post-independence it became increasingly airbrushed out of history of that these men existed and World War One cemeteries and memorials were ignored. There are parts of Ireland where if you say a relative served in Crown Forces during this era you are risking getting into a physical fight. These men were not perceived as serving a foreign power. The actual history is a great deal more complicated and grey but I wouldn't want to try explaining that to a bunch of drunk blokes in Belfast or some similar situation.
When men deserted from the Irish Army to join the British Army in World War Two their pensions were cancelled and some of them were imprisoned when they returned to Ireland after the war. As they broke oaths to do it I can understand why they were punished but given the nature of the situation the govt. could have used some common sense and enacted the lightest punishment possible such as fining them wages or something similar. Many of those who served in British Forces in WW2 were not popular locally either. It's unfair but remember these men were perceived as serving in an army representing a nation that had occupied Ireland up until 1921 and was still occupying the northern six counties. The hate was still very real.
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Post by theguvnor on Jun 1, 2023 22:28:53 GMT
This is the central plate of the WW One memorial in Kilkenny below. As soon as it was put up this had people smashing the face up and writing 'traitors' on it and 'West Brit c***s' and similar stuff. It had to have permanent CCTV eventually. Even though the chief of staff of the Irish Defence Forces and other senior officers were there at the dedication a certain type of low life felt breaking this up was striking a blow for Ireland.
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