|
|
Post by RN69 on Aug 23, 2021 14:37:38 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by farronwolf on Aug 23, 2021 14:58:31 GMT
I hope the same thing happens, but like you suggested, those who are resistant, will find another reason beyond it "being experimental" to not get the vaccine.
This has all been too political and is causing too much pain and death as a result.
Hopefully one day we will be past all of this, but I fear it won't be any time soon.
|
|
|
|
Post by StellaMaris on Aug 23, 2021 22:20:12 GMT
Yes it is unfortunate that so many have put their full and blind faith in outlier 'experts' and political pundits with no expertise at all. They make a choice to believe that the CDC, the FDA, the immunologists and virologists currently working around the clock on studying this disease, the specialist doctors on the ground in covid wards and emergency departments and the global medical community... are all incompetent or fraudsters perpetrating diabolical evil on the world with vaccines.
It'd be an interesting study after all this is over into why some people choose against the experts we trust in most other areas of our day to day living.
|
|
|
|
Post by farronwolf on Aug 24, 2021 2:35:08 GMT
Yes it is unfortunate that so many have put their full and blind faith in outlier 'experts' and political pundits with no expertise at all. They make a choice to believe that the CDC, the FDA, the immunologists and virologists currently working around the clock on studying this disease, the specialist doctors on the ground in covid wards and emergency departments and the global medical community... are all incompetent or fraudsters perpetrating diabolical evil on the world with vaccines. It'd be an interesting study after all this is over into why some people choose against the experts we trust in most other areas of our day to day living. Don't forget it isn't just the American scientific and medical community which supports the vaccines, but pretty much the entire world of scientists, and medical professionals, except the outliers who want to perpetuate conspiracy theories, or the like. Yep, it is some global conspiracy theory driven by Bill Gates and the other people who want to take over the world and control us like robots. When all folks have to do is look into the mirror and do a bit of self reflection and realize how easily they have been manipulated into believing things that they should not be believing. |
|
joeg
Full Member
Posts: 135
|
Post by joeg on Aug 24, 2021 4:17:56 GMT
It will be interesting to read the actual FDA document on why they approved this vaccine so much faster than normal for a vaccine. An FDA proclamation does not change the study data or lack thereof. Supposedly the largest percentage of vaccine-hesitant people are people with a doctoral degree! I suspect that is because they can actually read the studies and are unimpressed by the junk COVID-19 studies. www.lifesitenews.com/news/americans-with-doctorates-are-least-likely-to-get-vaccinated-survey/Intelligent people will read the studies and recognize oddities that don't make sense. If you get your health news from corporate media funded by Pharma, the information below will likely be unfamiliar to you. Why were there almost no people with diabetes in one of Pfizer's safety studies, yet diabetes with complications is one of the most important risk factors for Covid death according to recent CDC data. www.cdc.gov/pcd/issues/2021/pdf/21_0123.pdfIn general the percentage of people with comorbidities seemed low in the pre-Delta Pfizer study as explained by Dr Chris Martenson in a short clip. youtu.be/NRP-_2v8mSQ?t=841The recent Delta data for Pfizer's vaccine looks quite poor. This is from a Mayo Clinic study. " in July, the effectiveness against infection was considerably lower for mRNA-1273 [Moderna] (76%, 95% CI: 58-87%) with an even more pronounced reduction in effectiveness for BNT162b2 [Pfizer] (42%, 95% CI: 13-62%) www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.06.21261707v1.full.pdfThe data out if Israel is similarly poor. They use Pfizer vaccine exclusively. The actual pdf is in Hebrew so I'm sharing reports about it. www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/309762"Aug. 5, Dr. Kobi Haviv, director of the Herzog Hospital in Jerusalem, appeared on Channel 13 News, reporting that 95% of severely ill COVID-19 patients are fully vaccinated, and that they make up 85% to 90% of COVID-related hospitalizations overall. As of Aug. 2, 66.9% of Israelis had received at least one dose of Pfizer’s injection, which is used exclusively in Israel; 62.2% had received two doses." childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/cdc-manipulated-data-create-pandemic-unvaxxed-narrative/Wouldn't you expect the percentage of vaccinated people in the hospital to be lower than in the general population? Hopefully that issue is due to the high number of elderly who were among the first to be vaccinated, not Antibody Dependent Enhancement that was seen in some previous coronavirus vaccines, notably Fauci's very problematic Dengue vaccine. This is from a computer modeling study from France so not proof. It is also not just about Pfizer. However antibody dependent enhancement (ADE) is a vaccine's kryptonite. It is basically where a future variant ends up being *more* dangerous to people vaccinated with a vaccine designed to protect people from an earlier variant. "Neutralizing antibodies" are the desirable ones. "Facilitating antibodies" are those associated with ADE. "our data suggest that the balance between neutralizing and facilitating antibodies in vaccinated individuals is in favor of neutralization for the original Wuhan/D614G strain. However, in the case of the Delta variant, neutralizing antibodies have a decreased affinity for the spike protein, whereas facilitating antibodies display a strikingly increased affinity. Thus, ADE may be a concern for people receiving vaccines based on the original Wuhan strain spike sequence (either mRNA or viral vectors). " www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8351274/If you find it mind boggling that some people would be hesitant to get the vaccine, skim through this long article listing reasons that you probably have not heard from corporate media. trialsitenews.com/why-so-many-americans-are-refusing-to-get-vaccinated/Hmm, good to hear that they are so ethical. www.naturalnews.com/2021-08-17-pfizer-will-not-mandate-covid-vaccines-employees.html |
|
|
|
Post by ratioetfides on Aug 24, 2021 17:52:22 GMT
Some thoughts about the LifeSite article:
The original source has recently added the follow disclaimer on its homepage:
‘Caution: Preprints are preliminary reports of work that have not been certified by peer review. They should not be relied on to guide clinical practice or health-related behavior and should not be reported in news media as established information.’
(Please note the disclaimer there is in high-Viz RED!) Curiously this is a missing detail from LifeSite’s reporting.
The article makes claims the study does not make and makes claims the study was not even designed to evaluate. In the non-peer reviewed pre-print the researchers conclude risks factors for vaccine hesitancy include, among many others, less than or equal to highschool education and holding a PhD.
Despite the claims of Lifesite the Adjusted Relative Risk factor for PhD’s in the study is 1.20 placing the groups below both less than or equal to high school and some college.
It is important to keep in mind these education levels are self reported by internet responders. The researchers note the unusually high number of PhD’s in the sample. If the number is accurate, it would be interesting to know in what fields these responders have earned their PhD’s and from which institutions.
Rather than claim PhD’s are the most likely to report vaccine hesitancy the researchers indicate those holding a PhD is the only education group in the study which requires further investigation.
It may be of interest to some the study was funded by the ‘evil tech over lords at Facebook’ and the ‘international criminals’ at the CDC.
|
|
|
|
Post by ratioetfides on Aug 24, 2021 17:53:48 GMT
8% of the participants in the Pfizer clinical trial were diabetics. This mirrors the US population fairly closely. What is the suggested number for diabetics in such a clinical study? Additionally 35% of the participants were ‘obese’ and 8% suffered from pulmonary disease. www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/Pfizer-BioNTech.html‘The most frequent underlying medical conditions among clinical trial participants were obesity (35%), diabetes (8%), and pulmonary disease (8%).’ |
|
|
|
Post by ratioetfides on Aug 24, 2021 17:54:30 GMT
The ‘Mayo Clinic’ study by Puranik and Lenehan is hosted by the same organization as the study in the LifeSite article under the same caution.
If one is willing to ignore the caution and accept the results of the study as true it may be prudent to acknowledge what the researchers actually concluded from their results:
‘mRNA-1273 [Moderna] and BNT162b2 [Pfizer] were originally designed, tested, and proven to reduce the burden of symptomatic disease, hospitalization, and death related to SARS-CoV-2 infection. This study further supports the effectiveness of both vaccines in doing so, even despite the evolution of more transmissible viral variants. It is important to realize that most vaccines are not 100%
effective, particularly against asymptomatic infections.”
and
‘Our observational study suggests that while both mRNA COVID-19 vaccines strongly protect against infection and severe disease, there are differences in their real-world effectiveness relative to each other and relative to prior months of the pandemic.’
The researchers also call for other larger studies to guide public health policy as to who should get which vaccine and when/ to whom to administer boosters.
|
|
|
|
Post by ratioetfides on Aug 24, 2021 17:56:57 GMT
To put the reporting about Dr Kobi Haviv in context here is an article written by Meredith Wadman and published by Science 8/16/2021. You can simply click on the author’s name in the byline to view credentials. www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta‘As of 15 August, 514 Israelis were hospitalized with severe or critical COVID-19, a 31% increase from just 4 days earlier. Of the 514, 59% were fully vaccinated. Of the vaccinated, 87% were 60 or older. “There are so many breakthrough infections that they dominate and most of the hospitalized patients are actually vaccinated,” says Uri Shalit, a bioinformatician at the Israel Institute of Technology (Technion) who has consulted on COVID-19 for the government. “One of the big stories from Israel [is]: ‘Vaccines work, but not well enough.’” There is plenty of other similar and reputable reporting on the subject from well qualified and credible sources. Generally speaking, no, it’s not great news. It is true many of the severe hospitalized cases in Israel are among older persons. And it is true they were among the first to be vaccinated. It should be noted it is a well known tactic among fear mongers to place two somewhat related subjects side by side and allow readers to infer a link between the two. Nobody is saying ADE (antibody dependent enhancement) is not a thing. ADE was properly considered during development; no evidence of ADE was shown in the Stage 3 trials. What many are asking for is one single credible piece of evidence ADE is occurring in vaccinated human persons. Billions of doses have been administered; hundreds of millions in the US alone. Where is the evidence? Just one piece of credible evidence and perhaps people making such claims can be taken seriously. (Perhaps the response is ‘just wait it will show up in’ March, April, July, August, September, certainly by January, 2022, 2024, 2030, 2055, etc.) |
|
|
|
Post by ratioetfides on Aug 24, 2021 18:04:02 GMT
Follow the trialsitenews article deep enough and you eventually land on the MIT study which does in fact say increased public access to data, including visual representation sof data, is not likey to persuade many of the vaccine hesitant or the anti-COVID-vaxxers. Essentially the study concludes this is because those encouraging vaccine hesitancy have become quite adept at presenting, manipulating and in some cases twisting data to suit ideological views. Those encouraging vaccine hesitancy have found a large and willing audience largely on social media platforms. news.mit.edu/2021/when-more-covid-data-doesnt-equal-more-understanding-0304“Data visualizations “carry a veneer of objectivity and scientific precision. But as this paper shows, data visualizations can be used effectively on opposite sides of an issue,” he says. “It underscores the complexity of the problem — that it is not enough to ‘just teach media literacy.’ It requires a more nuanced sociopolitical understanding of those creating and interpreting data graphics.” It also uses just horrible data from Dr Hoffe the evidence of which he has not even released publicly…likely because it is too scientifically embarrassing. Further reliance is upon www.skirsch.com/covid/VaccineFAQ.pdfOne can just scan the first few pages there to see abysmal data references and ideological tropes. Perhaps the one of the most interesting revelation was about people who are very careful about what they put in their body and want nothing ‘experimental’ yet are content to run down to the feed store for some live stock de-wormer…Ivermectine. |
|
|
|
Post by ratioetfides on Aug 24, 2021 18:04:41 GMT
After drilling down far enough all the claims about the leaked Pfizer document concerning employee vaccination status originate from Alex Berenson. Berenson has been dubbed by some “The Pandemic’s Wrongest Man.”
The photos of the document appears to have an oddly cropped and very poorly printed (in relation to the text) Pfizer logo in the header.
If the document is authentic, was put into force, and taken at face value, Pfizer is expecting all employees without medical or religious exemptions to be vaccinated. Those who are not vaccinated will be required to undergo regular testing. There may be additional precautions regarding the unvaccinated which are not mentioned in this particular document.
How is this supposed to be some kind of ‘smoking gun’ indicating Pfizer knows it’s vaccines are unsafe? Really??
|
|
|
|
Post by ratioetfides on Aug 24, 2021 18:05:49 GMT
Point by point rebuttal and refutation to/of claims will not convince many vaccine hesitant or most of the anti-COVID-vaxxers of the inaccuracy of so many claims.
It is important to listen to, acknowledge, and address the legitimate concerns about the pandemic, efforts to slow the spread, and vaccines. Unfortunately an entire cottage industry has arisen around promoting wild claims and misinformation. Extraordinary claims against the pandemic and the vaccines are made with very poor or no reasoning, science, or evidence. Then demands are made each of these claims must be definitively disproven. It is a very similar situation to the after effects of the 2020 US elections.
Many of the vaccine hesitant and most of the anti-COVID-vaxxers will completely discount the so called ‘pharma funded’ media, science, scholarship, and health officials. At the same time the same persons will find figures funded by ad revenue, supplement sales, podcast subscriptions, internet donations, appearance fees, clinical fees, and consulting fees to be completely credible and beyond reproach.
|
|
|
|
Post by ratioetfides on Aug 24, 2021 18:07:17 GMT
None of the above is to be construed as medical advice. Those interested in vaccination or lack there of should consult their trusted medical and vaccine providers.
|
|
|
|
Post by RN69 on Aug 25, 2021 12:43:35 GMT
ratioetfides Excellent and rational rebuttals. Thank you for taking the time to research and post this all. And you're right, probably won't change some peoples mind but maybe give pause to others to reconsider. Also the annual tri-valent or quadra-valent flu vaccine is sometimes only between 40-50% effect against what ever influenza is circulating yet I still take it to increase my chances on surviving the flu. WHO and CDC start swabbing noses around the world to figure out which of the A and B flu strains are prominent. They have to give this information to the pharmaceutical companies early in order for them to begin formulating the flu vaccine. The tri-valent always has 2 A strains and 1 B strain flu vaccine where as the quadra-valent contains 2 A and 2 B strains. No matter what brand of pharmaceutical company's flu shot you get every one has the same strains as dictated by WHO and CDC. The so called "senior shot" or high dose flu vaccine for 65 years and older is 4 times stronger because that population has a weaker immune response system. Ever since I was eligible for HD flu vaccine, I didn't come down with any flu symptoms even though I was still working in a Drs office at the time. If you are eligible for HD and can find it that is best choice. Our office would frequently run short of the HD flu vaccine due to the demand. I already have a Drs office appointment scheduled on 9/9/21 and will be getting my 2021-2022 flu shot then as long as they aren't short of it.
|
|
joeg
Full Member
Posts: 135
|
Post by joeg on Oct 10, 2021 2:53:31 GMT
I did not see anything on the cdc page about the % of obese people in the Pfizer 6 months safety study. Dr. Chris Martenson in his review of the study was very disappointed in the weak obesity data in the study. He also provided a reference showing that the % of diabetics in the study was a fraction of the number of diabetics in the US population. www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRP-_2v8mSQ&t=841s This is an interesting article about the FDA (pseudo)approval of the Pfizer vaccine. 10 reasons why the FDA approval for Pfizer jab isn’t about health, but about forcing people to take the shot The fact is, Pfizer’s clinical trials don’t end until May 2023. www.lifesitenews.com/blogs/10-reasons-why-the-fda-approval-for-pfizer-jab-isnt-about-health-but-about-forcing-people-to-take-the-shot/The unpredictable risk of future antibody dependent enhancement is sufficient alone to not take the vaccine if your risk of a bad outcome with the virus is not high. |
|
