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Post by homeschooldad on Nov 22, 2023 0:29:00 GMT
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Post by homeschooldad on Nov 22, 2023 0:34:10 GMT
Finally found the video that I saw earlier this evening (I don't do X/Twitter).
ProBoards does weird things with X/Twitter links, so you'll have to copy this into your browser or something:
"https://twitter.com/Michael_Voris/status/1727102250311733320" (you'll have to take out the quotation marks, I put those in there on purpose to be able to post the link).
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Post by tisbearself on Nov 22, 2023 2:27:08 GMT
I sinned big for enough years that I'm not in a position to point fingers, at least not when it involves consenting adults.
Edited to add, it's disturbing to see Steve Skojec complaining on the Twitter feed and Mike Parrott from Restoring the Faith actually having a celebratory drink on YouTube. Whatever happened to "love your enemies", "forgive 70 times 7 times", and "be the bigger person"? Sometimes I think this is all just fake Yippie Catholic theater.
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Post by homeschooldad on Nov 22, 2023 7:57:41 GMT
I sinned big for enough years that I'm not in a position to point fingers, at least not when it involves consenting adults. Edited to add, it's disturbing to see Steve Skojec complaining on the Twitter feed and Mike Parrott from Restoring the Faith actually having a celebratory drink on YouTube. Whatever happened to "love your enemies", "forgive 70 times 7 times", and "be the bigger person"? Sometimes I think this is all just fake Yippie Catholic theater. I have edited my original post to remove comments that could have come across as judgmental. I've done a few things in my life that wouldn't square with CM's "morality clause" either, though I shall just say that they didn't involve gay sex. I'm not into that kind of thing.
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Post by theguvnor on Nov 22, 2023 9:51:27 GMT
These groups strike me as performance art in a Catholic space. Having a drink because someone sins strikes me as very silly indeed. It is equivalent to adults on internet forums who start talking about how they will do 'beatdowns' because someone says something they don't like.
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Post by tisbearself on Nov 22, 2023 11:25:19 GMT
We had to watch Altman yelling the equivalent of Axl Rose's "get in the ring" to Cardinal Cupich and Abp Vigneron. And Pavone's antics with taking God's name in vain in political tweets. It's all straight out of the playbooks of Abbie Hoffman and pro wrestling. It's ridiculous.
Christine Niles, the former CM investigative reporter who left on Nov 10, has her own Twitter video up (no dirt-dishing, she mostly just mentioned she was concerned about Michael for a couple years because he was barely coming into the office and had stopped his previous habit of regular prayer with the staff) and Skojec is complaining on her post too. Guess I need to light a candle for him. He seems really bitter and carrying a grudge.
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Post by theguvnor on Nov 22, 2023 13:45:37 GMT
Father Altman strikes me as an odd-bod to say the least. We all have our eccentricities though. Or to use that particularly hilarious expression people of my parent's generation did, 'Every cripple walks in his own way.' Such a totally non-PC expression you can imagine jaws dropping if people used it in public nowadays.
Pro-Wrestling priests sounds quite entertaining. We could organize a whole Wrestling League around it.
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Post by blackforest on Nov 22, 2023 15:10:57 GMT
I can't believe this even needs theological clarification, but Church Militant doesn't save souls.
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Post by farronwolf on Nov 22, 2023 16:28:08 GMT
It is one thing to admit one is a sinner. We all are. But I have no tolerance for people who make a living off of calling out other people publicly for their sins, or perceived sins or failings when the person/s making their living off of being judgmental publicly, are behind the scenes being as sinful or even more sinful than those who they constantly rant about.
That is the height of hypocrisy.
I have no sympathy for Voris or those who act similarly to him. They displayed no sympathy for the people who they continually berated, and used the division which they created to line their pockets.
You reap what you sow, and I would be pleased if Voris never made a dime more from the actions he has taken.
As far as folks having a celebratory drink over this, well just imagine the number of high fives or other celebrations that Voris himself did after posting articles, or giving a speech and seeing the dollars roll in. It is all a matter of perspective.
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Post by tisbearself on Nov 22, 2023 16:28:31 GMT
I can't believe this even needs theological clarification, but Church Militant doesn't save souls.
I wouldn't be so quick to judge that. I personally know people who have been evangelized/ brought closer to God through CM. Sometimes we don't see that stuff that doesn't work for us, might work for someone else who's different from us. There is not one way/ one size that fits all. Sadly we all have the tendency to just dismiss organizations and approaches that we don't like rather than considering their positive impact on someone else.
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Post by homeschooldad on Nov 22, 2023 16:37:15 GMT
It is one thing to admit one is a sinner. We all are. But I have no tolerance for people who make a living off of calling out other people publicly for their sins, or perceived sins or failings when the person/s making their living off of being judgmental publicly, are behind the scenes being as sinful or even more sinful than those who they constantly rant about. That is the height of hypocrisy. I have no sympathy for Voris or those who act similarly to him. They displayed no sympathy for the people who they continually berated, and used the division which they created to line their pockets. You reap what you sow, and I would be pleased if Voris never made a dime more from the actions he has taken. As far as folks having a celebratory drink over this, well just imagine the number of high fives or other celebrations that Voris himself did after posting articles, or giving a speech and seeing the dollars roll in. It is all a matter of perspective. To the extent humanly possible, money needs to be separated from religion. Nobody should be able to profit from being a "professional Catholic". If you work for the Church or in an apostolate, and if that is your full-time job, you should earn a decent living wage for you and your family (which, per Aquinas, admits of the possibility of having a modest savings as well), and that should be it.
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Post by tisbearself on Nov 22, 2023 16:41:40 GMT
It is one thing to admit one is a sinner. We all are. But I have no tolerance for people who make a living off of calling out other people publicly for their sins, or perceived sins or failings when the person/s making their living off of being judgmental publicly, are behind the scenes being as sinful or even more sinful than those who they constantly rant about. That is the height of hypocrisy. I have no sympathy for Voris or those who act similarly to him. They displayed no sympathy for the people who they continually berated, and used the division which they created to line their pockets. You reap what you sow, and I would be pleased if Voris never made a dime more from the actions he has taken. As far as folks having a celebratory drink over this, well just imagine the number of high fives or other celebrations that Voris himself did after posting articles, or giving a speech and seeing the dollars roll in. It is all a matter of perspective. To the extent humanly possible, money needs to be separated from religion. Nobody should be able to profit from being a "professional Catholic". If you work for the Church or in an apostolate, and if that is your full-time job, you should earn a decent living wage for you and your family (which, per Aquinas, admits of the possibility of having a modest savings as well), and that should be it. If Voris was celebrating because someone else fell from grace, that's equally bad. However, Parrott doing it isn't somehow justified because Voris did it. OnePeterFive has posted a charitable response which is what I like to see from Catholics and strive to emulate. onepeterfive.com/michael-voris-repents/
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Post by homeschooldad on Nov 22, 2023 17:12:54 GMT
To the extent humanly possible, money needs to be separated from religion. Nobody should be able to profit from being a "professional Catholic". If you work for the Church or in an apostolate, and if that is your full-time job, you should earn a decent living wage for you and your family (which, per Aquinas, admits of the possibility of having a modest savings as well), and that should be it. If Voris was celebrating because someone else fell from grace, that's equally bad. However, Parrott doing it isn't somehow justified because Voris did it. OnePeterFive has posted a charitable response which is what I like to see from Catholics and strive to emulate. onepeterfive.com/michael-voris-repents/Indeed. I agree with 1P5 on this. Even Where Peter Is, which never saw a "Francis thing" they didn't like, echoes similar sentiments, albeit embedded within an overall hatchet job on CM: wherepeteris.com/michael-voris-forced-out-at-church-militant/
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Post by blackforest on Nov 22, 2023 18:29:32 GMT
I can't believe this even needs theological clarification, but Church Militant doesn't save souls.
I wouldn't be so quick to judge that. I personally know people who have been evangelized/ brought closer to God through CM. Sometimes we don't see that stuff that doesn't work for us, might work for someone else who's different from us. There is not one way/ one size that fits all. Sadly we all have the tendency to just dismiss organizations and approaches that we don't like rather than considering their positive impact on someone else. No, I'm afraid the Mystery of co-redemption doesn't work like that. CM doesn't save souls. Christ saves the souls of those who chose to follow Him. CM may run off with the credit for someone's inscription into RCIA. But their claim of saving souls is theologically incorrect and reflects an arrogance to that site that I've long found off-putting.
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Post by tisbearself on Nov 22, 2023 19:05:21 GMT
I wouldn't be so quick to judge that. I personally know people who have been evangelized/ brought closer to God through CM. Sometimes we don't see that stuff that doesn't work for us, might work for someone else who's different from us. There is not one way/ one size that fits all. Sadly we all have the tendency to just dismiss organizations and approaches that we don't like rather than considering their positive impact on someone else. No, I'm afraid the Mystery of co-redemption doesn't work like that. CM doesn't save souls. Christ saves the souls of those who chose to follow Him. CM may run off with the credit for someone's inscription into RCIA. But their claim of saving souls is theologically incorrect and reflects an arrogance to that site that I've long found off-putting. You're kind of splitting hairs. Many Catholic organizations and indeed Christian organizations and clergy will say they are in the business of saving souls, while still giving glory to God. There's no reason to think CM wouldn't do the same. But, it's clear that you just don't like them and will always find a reason to pick at them, so have fun with that.
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